Serious Writers' Forum (1209 hits)
Category: NoneRating: 0.34 on 109 reviews (Rate this item) (V)
Submitted by Flash Harry (View user info) at 2010-02-22 05:32:04 EST
A selection of rules, tips and suggestions from various writers:
Never use the word "then" as a conjunction – we have "and" for this purpose. Substituting "then" is the lazy or tone-deaf writer's non-solution to the problem of too many "ands" on the page.
Write in the third person unless a really distinctive first-person voice offers itself irresistibly.
It's doubtful that anyone with an internet connection at his workplace is writing good fiction.
Cut out the metaphors and similes.
Remember: when people tell you something's wrong or doesn't work for them, they are almost always right. When they tell you exactly what they think is wrong and how to fix it, they are almost always wrong.
Remember you love writing. It wouldn't be worth it if you didn't. If the love fades, do what you need to and get it back.
Remember writing doesn't love you. It doesn't care. Nevertheless, it can behave with remarkable generosity. Speak well of it, encourage others, pass it on.
Never use a verb other than "said" to carry dialogue. The line of dialogue belongs to the character; the verb is the writer sticking his nose in. But "said" is far less intrusive than "grumbled", "gasped", "cautioned", "lied".
Never use an adverb to modify the verb "said" . . . he admonished gravely. To use an adverb this way (or almost any way) is a mortal sin. The writer is now exposing himself in earnest, using a word that distracts and can interrupt the rhythm of the exchange.
Never use the words "suddenly" or "all hell broke loose". This rule doesn't require an explanation.
Use regional dialect, patois, sparingly. Once you start spelling words in dialogue phonetically and loading the page with apostrophes, you won't be able to stop. Notice the way Annie Proulx captures the flavour of Wyoming voices in her book of short stories Close Range.
Avoid detailed descriptions of characters. In Ernest Hemingway's "Hills Like White Elephants", what do the "Ameri¬can and the girl with him" look like? "She had taken off her hat and put it on the table." That's the only reference to a physical description in the story.
Do give the work a name as quickly as possible. Own it, and see it. Dickens knew Bleak House was going to be called Bleak House before he started writing it. The rest must have been easy.
Do restrict your browsing to a few websites a day. Don't go near the online bookies – unless it's research.
Finish the day's writing when you still want to continue.
Have regrets. They are fuel. On the page they flare into desire.
Only bad writers think that their work is really good.
If you have a good story idea, don't assume it must form a prose narrative. It may work better as a play, a screenplay or a poem. Be flexible.
Concentrate your narrative energy on the point of change. This is especially important for historical fiction. When your character is new to a place, or things alter around them, that's the point to step back and fill in the details of their world. People don't notice their everyday surroundings and daily routine, so when writers describe them it can sound as if they're trying too hard to instruct the reader.
Description must work for its place. It can't be simply ornamental. It ¬usually works best if it has a human element; it is more effective if it comes from an implied viewpoint, rather than from the eye of God. If description is coloured by the viewpoint of the character who is doing the noticing, it becomes, in effect, part of character definition and part of the action.
Introduce your main characters and themes in the first third of your novel – the introduction.
Develop your themes and characters in your second third, the development.
Resolve your themes, mysteries and so on in the final third, the resolution.
If possible have something going on while you have your characters delivering exposition or philosophising. This helps retain dramatic tension.
Write a story as if you’re talking to your best friend.
Keep in mind Oscar Wilde: "A little sincerity is a dangerous thing, and a great deal of it is absolutely fatal."
Don't look back until you've written an entire draft, just begin each day from the last sentence you wrote the preceeding day. This prevents those cringing feelings, and means that you have a substantial body of work before you get down to the real work which is all in the edit.
You know that sickening feeling of inadequacy and over-exposure you feel when you look upon your own empurpled prose? Relax into the awareness that this ghastly sensation will never, ever leave you, no matter how successful and publicly lauded you become. It is intrinsic to the real business of writing and should be cherished.
Stick up a post-it saying "Faire et se taire" (Flaubert), which translates as "Shut up and get on with it."
Avoid your weaknesses. But do this without telling yourself that the things you can't do aren't worth doing. Don't mask self-doubt with contempt.
Leave a decent space of time between writing something and editing it.
Work on a computer that is disconnected from the internet.
No alcohol, sex or drugs while you are working.
Forget the boring old dictum "write about what you know". Instead, seek out an unknown yet knowable area of experience that's going to enhance your understanding of the world and write about that.
Never be satisfied with a first draft. In fact, never be satisfied with your own stuff at all, until you're certain it's as good as your finite powers can ¬enable it to be.
Respect the way characters may change once they've got 50 pages of life in them. Revisit your plan at this stage and see whether certain things have to be altered to take account of these changes.
Treat writing as a job. Be disciplined. Lots of writers get a bit OCD-ish about this. Graham Greene famously wrote 500 words a day. Jean Plaidy managed 5,000 before lunch, then spent the afternoon answering fan mail. My minimum is 1,000 words a day – which is sometimes easy to achieve, and is sometimes, frankly, like shitting a brick, but I will make myself stay at my desk until I've got there, because I know that by doing that I am inching the book forward. Those 1,000 words might well be rubbish – they often are. But then, it is always easier to return to rubbish words at a later date and make them better.
Pace is crucial. Fine writing isn't enough. Writing students can be great at producing a single page of well-crafted prose; what they sometimes lack is the ability to take the reader on a journey, with all the changes of terrain, speed and mood that a long journey involves. Again, I find that looking at films can help. Most novels will want to move close, linger, move back, move on, in pretty cinematic ways.
User Reviews
Submitted by willartstorg (user info) at 2010-03-01 20:45:41 EST (#)
Ranking: -2
Yeah, they're real assholes, huh? So much for Bell being so fucking cool.
Submitted by X54 (user info) at 2010-03-01 20:32:48 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
Why, those fuckers over at the Guardian PLAGIARIZED FJ's POST!
Submitted by willartstorg (user info) at 2010-03-01 20:06:47 EST (#)
Ranking: -2
Submitted by bart (user info) at 2010-02-24 19:10:11 EST (#)
Ranking: -2
You forgot one...
Never plagiarize without giving credit
=======
A-FUCKING-MEN
http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/2010/feb/20/ten-rules-for-writing-fiction-part-one
Submitted by Judgement (user info) at 2010-02-26 08:01:07 EST (#)
Ranking: -2
No Comment
Submitted by HurtByTheSun (user info) at 2010-02-26 07:15:57 EST (#)
Ranking: -2
Submitted by bart (user info) at 2010-02-25 00:10:11 GMT (#)
Ranking: -2
You forgot one...
Never plagiarize without giving credit
============
Cilfowned.
Submitted by ICO (user info) at 2010-02-26 05:45:17 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
Way to objectify writing. You're making writing something into a protocol, thereby overlooking the fact that authors all work in their own way. Hunter Thompson and Jack Kerouac are two examples of the entire catalogue of good, succesfull writers that would never have written their works if they followed your suggestions (especially the one about laying off the narcotics).
Also, it seems to me you impose your opinion a little too much as fact. In certain cases, for example, exchanging the word 'said' with something a little more colourful can create atmosphere.
I haven't read the long list of reviews, so excuse me if this is redundant.
Submitted by orphelia (user info) at 2010-02-26 03:59:54 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
You know what no need to answer
don't post elmore leonards though, i just read that one
i love that guy
Submitted by orphelia (user info) at 2010-02-26 00:30:03 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
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Submitted by gina (user info) at 2010-02-24 14:16:25 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
Somehow, this carried more gravitas when it was printed in the "The Guardian."
~~~
really?
Submitted by bart (user info) at 2010-02-24 19:10:11 EST (#)
Ranking: -2
You forgot one...
Never plagiarize without giving credit
Submitted by sicosemen (user info) at 2010-02-24 14:28:31 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
I used to pronounce the name below as g-eee-na, but now I pronounce it as jai-na!
Submitted by gina (user info) at 2010-02-24 14:16:25 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
Somehow, this carried more gravitas when it was printed in the "The Guardian."
Submitted by orphelia (user info) at 2010-02-23 04:18:51 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
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Submitted by F.J.Bell (user info) at 2010-02-23 04:14:45 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
Me and Bickerstaff are like this: *crosses fingers*
~~~
she probably fancies you.
Submitted by F.J.Bell (user info) at 2010-02-23 04:14:45 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
Me and Bickerstaff are like this: *crosses fingers*
Submitted by orphelia (user info) at 2010-02-23 04:12:04 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
I'm a noob what do I know. Oh. that explains the 1.2 average :(
I thought I was just clever and witty.
:*(
Submitted by iddqd (user info) at 2010-02-23 04:10:40 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
heat isnt vagina-related.
ratings are vagina-related.
Submitted by orphelia (user info) at 2010-02-23 04:06:02 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
HOW did you get all this heat without a vagina?
Or doing an annoying Cheerios type political post (no offence Cheerio)?
:(
After extensive research on your bum rash I have determined it not to be shaving pimples :(
Sorry
Submitted by FilledwithHate (user info) at 2010-02-23 01:48:38 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
FANTASTIC FUCKING ADVICE HERE, BRAVO!
Submitted by pen_name (user info) at 2010-02-23 00:52:48 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
unshun/
I thought your "then" might have been part of a colloquialized speech pattern, but I could see no such excuse being made for the "your."
/reshun
Submitted by cocaine (user info) at 2010-02-23 00:44:01 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
pfft. it's also "than."
kind of the point.
sarcasm. learn it.
/dork.
Submitted by pen_name (user info) at 2010-02-23 00:39:48 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
Pfft. It's "you're."
/shun
Submitted by cocaine (user info) at 2010-02-23 00:08:51 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
What? Do you think your better then me?
Submitted by iddqd (user info) at 2010-02-22 20:18:11 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
i think this has gotten out of hand. just accept that anyone who thinks they need rules to know how to write is a fucking hack, and leave it at that.
no dissertations on the nature of art, no comparative discussions of various writers and their 'styles' and certainly no attempt to justify ones point of view by mentioning the number of articles/stories published/rejected or classes undertaken.
this is a copy-paste, which deserves a -2 right off, and its all pretty much completely incorrect, as it is some sort of attempt to standardise an artistic endeavour.
Submitted by pen_name (user info) at 2010-02-22 17:43:36 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
Submitted by Bickerstaff (user info) at 2010-02-22 16:43:37 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
I broke pretty much all of these before noon today.
I ain't saying they're wrong; that would be just as myopic as you saying they're right, which, of course, you haven't done. You've called them suggestions; I can get behind that, I guess.
------------------
bickerstaff is like normal folks. writes some shit and thinks it's not good enough to leave as a comment, but then forgets to delete the white space his comment created, exposing a secret truth: he is a careful muthafucka despite his carefree prose!
sheeeet
Submitted by pen_name (user info) at 2010-02-22 17:40:25 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
Submitted by icarus1987 (user info) at 2010-02-22 15:02:47 EST (#)
Ranking: -1
I've got another idea. How about I do whatever the fuck I want?
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ohhhh, tough guy! ima shake my fist at yew, muthafuka!
Submitted by Jack_McCallum (user info) at 2010-02-22 17:36:52 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
Never use a verb other than "said" to carry dialogue. The line of dialogue belongs to the character; the verb is the writer sticking his nose in. But "said" is far less intrusive than "grumbled", "gasped", "cautioned", "lied".
--
By God, you see some gems on Uber...
Submitted by Bickerstaff (user info) at 2010-02-22 16:43:37 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
I broke pretty much all of these before noon today.
I ain't saying they're wrong; that would be just as myopic as you saying they're right, which, of course, you haven't done. You've called them suggestions; I can get behind that, I guess.
Submitted by Snark (user info) at 2010-02-22 16:25:02 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
meh
Submitted by RoadSong (user info) at 2010-02-22 16:09:12 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
"No alcohol, sex or drugs while you are working."
~~~
How is this possible?
heh
Submitted by icarus1987 (user info) at 2010-02-22 15:02:47 EST (#)
Ranking: -1
I've got another idea. How about I do whatever the fuck I want?
Submitted by pen_name (user info) at 2010-02-22 14:44:44 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
Submitted by icarus1987 (user info) at 2010-02-22 09:20:16 EST (#)
Ranking: -1
'Serious writers' who troll the 'net offering English Major advice are like the 'martial artists' who join a dojo so they can say "I have a black belt."
Ie fuckheads.
Just my $0.02.
--------------------
here's a rule: write out "two cents," asshole.
Sometimes people are afraid of using idioms and cliches because think they might be labeled hacks. Instead, they rephrase them or alter the syntax to appear more clever and original. To me, they're just showing that they are insecure pussies.
Just my 1/50th of a dollar.
Submitted by orphelia (user info) at 2010-02-22 14:16:39 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
Maybe if I pretend to be gay and use indecorously long words to make me look clever maybe I can have the heat this poopy post STOLE :D
Now stop sending me pictures of the razor rash on your balls.
Submitted by cheerios (user info) at 2010-02-22 13:55:53 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
http://www.ubersite.com/m/124539
Submitted by rob_berg (user info) at 2010-02-22 13:49:02 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
FUCK YOU AND YOUR FANCY RULES, BELL.
Submitted by Jeanneee (user info) at 2010-02-22 13:47:59 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
Thanks for the tips!
Wait, no sex or drugs? What?
Submitted by willartstorg (user info) at 2010-02-22 13:44:52 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
Sico, I always tell the truth, but I won't this time. . .
:)
Submitted by icarus1987 (user info) at 2010-02-22 13:31:14 EST (#)
Ranking: -1
Oh good. You got that then.
Submitted by sicosemen (user info) at 2010-02-22 12:52:38 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
I'm going to pick 3, bubba. Also, it's a dedication piece of sorts. hard to describe. Who cares anyway? I got Icarus to do your job but thanks for offering in the first place.
Submitted by Awesome (user info) at 2010-02-22 12:43:47 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
Awesome!
Submitted by willartstorg (user info) at 2010-02-22 12:10:50 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
SICOSEMEN: My apologies. Pick one:
1) My eyesight is just starting to return after reading your first paragraph.
2) The aliens went overboard with the probing this weekend.
3) I got distracted when the family showed up for the weekend.
4) Seriously, the last word in the piece should be the title.
Sorry.
Submitted by trifonga (user info) at 2010-02-22 11:41:36 EST (#)
Ranking: -2
stfu
Submitted by F.J.Bell (user info) at 2010-02-22 11:30:40 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
I take it like a girl too :o(
Submitted by TuTs (user info) at 2010-02-22 11:24:44 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
Yeah Frasier Jane is pretty girly.
Submitted by icarus1987 (user info) at 2010-02-22 11:22:09 EST (#)
Ranking: -1
Submitted by forensicgirl3 (user info) at 2010-02-22 11:15:48 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
Phineas Wombledorf is pretty gay.
Ooops. Sorry man.
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RAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!
Submitted by F.J.Bell (user info) at 2010-02-22 11:17:24 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
Not a day goes past that I am not disappointed with how gay my name is.
Submitted by triangle_man (user info) at 2010-02-22 11:15:56 EST (#)
Ranking: 1
smileys??? oh similies...LOL
Submitted by forensicgirl3 (user info) at 2010-02-22 11:15:48 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
Phineas Wombledorf is pretty gay.
Ooops. Sorry man.
Submitted by icarus1987 (user info) at 2010-02-22 11:12:41 EST (#)
Ranking: -1
That's true.
Submitted by sicosemen (user info) at 2010-02-22 11:10:45 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
Why would I ever tell anyone your real name? It's not like you can get a more faggoty name than Simon, you know.
Submitted by icarus1987 (user info) at 2010-02-22 11:06:27 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
icarus1987.at.yahoo.com
BUT IF YOU EVER TELL ANYONE MY REAL NAME I SHALL BE SERIOUSLY PUT OUT
Submitted by F.J.Bell (user info) at 2010-02-22 11:04:46 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
I wouldn't have time to proofread anything for a few days, bitchtits.
Submitted by TuTs (user info) at 2010-02-22 11:04:27 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
I would love to demoralise you simon, but unfortunately they haven't worked out how to get physical contact to travel via the internet yet.
Submitted by sicosemen (user info) at 2010-02-22 11:01:27 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
Speaking of writing. Do either of you two bickering fags want to proofread something for me? I tried to get bubba to do it and while I didn't specify a time frame he's had all weekend. I guess an alcoholic stupor is to blame for that. Hell, I don't blame it but I'd like to post today.
SO, who wants to tell me how shitty I am at writing and really demoralize me?
Submitted by icarus1987 (user info) at 2010-02-22 10:52:08 EST (#)
Ranking: -1
Meh, sour grapes, FJ. I've gotten numerous rejection letters, sure. I've also been published on more than one occasion. Neither are relevant, and no it's not something I plan on going into here. A while back, Stephen King said that he wasn't planning on publishing any more books, but that he would continue writing. This pissed a lot of English Majors off, but I honestly saw his point. Writing is more than a simple commercial pursuit.
As for giving people 'pointers', what works for one author would be a pitfall for another. Consider your use of Hemmingway above. Hemmingway's lack of character description worked because it was consistent with his style; ie stoicism. Try applying Hemmingway's stoicism to Chaucer, whose character description went into enormous depth. Twain, Faulkner, and Melville all used regional patois to great effect. O'Brian and a hundred other very talented authors used words like 'asked', 'shouted', 'pondered' or even 'bellowed'. Keillor gave the exact opposite advice re: treating writing as a job.
Writing isn't like disarming a bomb. There aren't really any right or wrong ways to go about it. Advice like "It's doubtful that anyone with an internet connection at his workplace is writing good fiction" comes across as sour grapes. If Chaucer were alive today, I'm fairly certain he would have the internet.
I guess the bigger point is... why bother giving the advice? Why here? Do you honestly think that people come to some backwater web forum known for its shennanigans and alters to pick up tips on how to write quality prose?
Submitted by X54 (user info) at 2010-02-22 10:25:13 EST (#)
Ranking: -2
"No alcohol, sex or drugs while you are working."
Submitted by F.J.Bell (user info) at 2010-02-22 10:18:13 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
Of course writing is intangible and subjective - but what is the harm in discussing technique, offering advice, highlighting common mistakes and trying to help one another improve? Even if they are not groundbreaking, chances are that some writers (those who have perhaps not been writing for very long) will learn a thing or two. I know I found some of these tips handy when I first read them.
And of course you should write for the love of writing, for the thrill of the chase - but there's nothing wrong with trying to avoid common pitfalls and developing one's own narrative nous. There's nothing wrong with trying to become a better writer.
Also, this is not the first time I have seen you ranting about getting published and why shouldn't do it for the money, honey, and how you don't have to be a commercial success to be labelled 'a writer'. I can only assume your manuscripts have all come back with a generic rejection slip. Commiserations.
Submitted by icarus1987 (user info) at 2010-02-22 10:01:18 EST (#)
Ranking: -1
Canterbury Tales to your average teen vampire novel
Submitted by icarus1987 (user info) at 2010-02-22 10:00:22 EST (#)
Ranking: -1
Submitted by F.J.Bell (user info) at 2010-02-22 09:22:57 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
What is wrong with trying to share some advice? You people have weird principles.
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Tut tut. You asked me for my advice and I gave it.
I believe that people should write because it's something they enjoy doing, and at some level something they feel like they have to do. Recognition and money are not the proper motivators, as poor writing will always be more marketable than good writing (compare Canterbury Tales to . I don't think people should write just to get published, I don't believe that published writers are the only ones with a right to call themselves "writers", and people who enters the field just to gain some status symbol are like the Westerner fools who go into Karate just so they can wear a black belt.
My rating on this post has nothing to do with your offering advice on other user's posts. It's not something I've ever seen you do*. I've heard half of these a thousand times, and think the other half are often bunk. Writing is one of the more intangible arts, and there as many styles/motivations as there are writers. Lovecraft's style wouldn't have worked for Joyce. Shakespeare's style woud have been shite for Hemmingway. If it were possible to create a set of specifications for what makes a 'serious writer', we could mass-produce them on an assembly line. As it is, that is impossible.
Now stop being such a silly bugger.
* Though honestly, I skim a lot don't pay much attention.
Submitted by forensicgirl3 (user info) at 2010-02-22 09:56:13 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
Submitted by TuTs (user info) at 2010-02-22 08:52:07 CST (#)
Ranking: 0
If my dogs are anything like me, stats and data send them running to their beds. You scare us.
=====
I actually want to go back home and hide under my covers until it all goes away.
Submitted by F.J.Bell (user info) at 2010-02-22 09:52:39 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
I work for a big American financial institute, doing the most boring and inconsequential job in the whole office. I hope to one day have an interesting job.
Can't be a goat-herder, but for legal reasons I can't go into that.
Submitted by TuTs (user info) at 2010-02-22 09:52:07 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
If my dogs are anything like me, stats and data send them running to their beds. You scare us.
Submitted by forensicgirl3 (user info) at 2010-02-22 09:49:10 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
I used to think I had an interesting/important job. I'm beginning to rethink that however and am considering goat herding as a career change.
Submitted by F.J.Bell (user info) at 2010-02-22 09:46:02 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
Haha, that's alright. Your job sounds infinitely more interesting than mine.
Last night I had a dream that I had ears like a spaniel - big, long, floppy ears covered in small curls and with that soft velvety texture inside them. I was irresistible.
Submitted by forensicgirl3 (user info) at 2010-02-22 09:45:54 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
Just make sure those dogs have all their discrepant data resolved before they soft-lock, Tuts.
Submitted by TuTs (user info) at 2010-02-22 09:43:06 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
I'm pretty sure soft locking is also something my dog's do when they mate.
Submitted by forensicgirl3 (user info) at 2010-02-22 09:41:25 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
Well, there are 6 countries participating in this study with something around 2,000 randomised subjects.
The subjects in America, Ireland, and Japan have completed the study so we're soft-locking those sites. Soft-locks stay there until the whole study is completed then it's locked locked.
With soft-locks, you can still go in and mess with the data if one of your nimrod sites pops up and says "whoops! we forgot this..." but we try to avoid it. That's why I want to scream now because just as I get finished (I think) with one subject, the site sends me something else which has to be reconcilled.
Then, I get to lock India, South America, and Italy. Around the middle to latter part of this year.
That's what it means. I'm sorry for stealing the few minutes of your life so that you could read this.
Submitted by F.J.Bell (user info) at 2010-02-22 09:34:18 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
I have no idea what that actually means, but good luck. And I approve of the term 'squirrelly'.
Submitted by forensicgirl3 (user info) at 2010-02-22 09:31:55 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
Getting a little tetchy and squirrelly. I'm soft-locking (not the big lock) 3 countries of a study I'm assigned to. I have this overwhelming urge to run screaming up and down the aisles.
Submitted by F.J.Bell (user info) at 2010-02-22 09:27:40 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
No, you are right forensicgirl. I kowtow to your superior rating.
I'm doing alright. Although I am skint and don't get paid until the end of the week and I have class tonight that I can't be arsed with. How's yourself?
Submitted by forensicgirl3 (user info) at 2010-02-22 09:24:47 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
I have a 1.64 (yours is 1.22) but you can't count that. I have a vagina so therefore my ratings can't be used as an objective measure for lack of fail.
Or so I've been told.
How y'all doing today?
Submitted by F.J.Bell (user info) at 2010-02-22 09:22:57 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
What is wrong with trying to share some advice? You people have weird principles.
Submitted by icarus1987 (user info) at 2010-02-22 09:20:16 EST (#)
Ranking: -1
'Serious writers' who troll the 'net offering English Major advice are like the 'martial artists' who join a dojo so they can say "I have a black belt."
Ie fuckheads.
Just my $0.02.
Submitted by F.J.Bell (user info) at 2010-02-22 09:17:18 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
Also, if someone turns up on this thread with a higher overall uber rating than me, THEN I'll listen. But until then you're all wrong.
Me > You. Uber rating means everything.
Submitted by TuTs (user info) at 2010-02-22 09:15:02 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
haha, why would anyone click on a sico link?
Submitted by F.J.Bell (user info) at 2010-02-22 09:14:58 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
Sico I would never talk to you like that, I have too much respect for you.
Also, re: the copypasta accusation, it is only half-merited; I edited and honed these statements in some cases, and deleted others which I did not agree with or felt were redundant. A little more complex than Ctrl+C Ctrl+V, I can assure you. But only a little.
Submitted by FALLEN (user info) at 2010-02-22 09:14:09 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
fuckfuckfucknononononononononono
do not click on sicos link
nonoooonoonononononmonononon
Submitted by sicosemen (user info) at 2010-02-22 09:11:30 EST (#)
Ranking: -2
http://thatsnotsexy.com/
Submitted by sicosemen (user info) at 2010-02-22 09:10:50 EST (#)
Ranking: -2
Can I get you to clarify between icarus and I who the shitebag is, please? All I'm saying is that for anyone else who does the copy and paste a plethora of well deserved -2's get handed out and I certainly don't think you should be an exception. You have a dumpy ass afterall, that really embarrasses a pair of women's underwear :) I kid. I've come to love you like the pet crabs in my bush but this is just unacceptable...unless you were talking to icarus in which case I was just joking.
Submitted by F.J.Bell (user info) at 2010-02-22 08:58:38 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
So offer an original piece of advice, shitebag.
Submitted by icarus1987 (user info) at 2010-02-22 08:49:13 EST (#)
Ranking: -1
1/2 of these 'rules' are the truisms you'll pick up in any "Creative Writing 101" course. Another 1/4 represent personal opinion or leanings; Keillor saw writing as a matter of procrastination; putting it all off until 4 AM when you can't hold it in anymore, and he's more famous than you'll ever be. The remainder seems to be a mixture of snobbery and sour grapes. True, Dickens and Shakespeare didn't have internet at their day job. If they worked in modern times, however, chances are they would.
Submitted by sicosemen (user info) at 2010-02-22 08:44:01 EST (#)
Ranking: -2
Well, I see that you have a strong grasp of the copy and paste functions.
Good for you.
Submitted by trifonga (user info) at 2010-02-22 08:36:22 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
No Comment
Submitted by TuTs (user info) at 2010-02-22 08:31:45 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
nah those pretentious Sydney siders don't drink cheap beer and I doubt there are any roo's hopping about town.
Submitted by orphelia (user info) at 2010-02-22 08:21:06 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
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Submitted by TuTs (user info) at 2010-02-22 08:16:07 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
night here orph.
~~~
well, he'll still be up hours drinking XXXX and shooting roo's, right?
Submitted by FALLEN (user info) at 2010-02-22 08:19:16 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
tl;dr
Submitted by TuTs (user info) at 2010-02-22 08:16:07 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
night here orph.
Submitted by orphelia (user info) at 2010-02-22 08:09:25 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
I am neither fat, ugly or old. I merely just picked on you iddqiddqd because you were the only one around nd I needed a toy to play with. Glad you took whatever you read from that little comment to heart though. let's hope it didn't entirely spoil your day.
Submitted by forensicgirl3 (user info) at 2010-02-22 08:03:07 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
~Never use a verb other than "said" to carry dialogue. The line of dialogue belongs to the character; the verb is the writer sticking his nose in. But "said" is far less intrusive than "grumbled", "gasped", "cautioned", "lied".~
Funny. I've heard at least two instructors advise their students to avoid using only this word.
Something like, "if your character screams that they're hurt, then they screamed. They didn't merely say it."
But I'm a shit writer and I'm ok with that! ;) I own my fail.
Submitted by TuTs (user info) at 2010-02-22 07:43:05 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
Now excuse me while I go and write an essay, with a thesis statement, paragraphs, punctuation and spell check.
Submitted by TuTs (user info) at 2010-02-22 07:41:49 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
Rules are for squares, I am rebel I tells ya, REBEL!
Submitted by F.J.Bell (user info) at 2010-02-22 07:26:55 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
A clarification: these are not my rules, they are from a collection of writers including Margaret Atwood, Neil Gaiman, Esther Freud, A.L. Kennedy, Joyce Carol Oates, Annie Proulx, Iain Rankin and oh God knows who else.
I just wanted to share.
Submitted by skrapmetal (user info) at 2010-02-22 07:15:14 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
Writing on the internet is serious business.
Submitted by GroundHorse (user info) at 2010-02-22 07:14:13 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
If you can't think, don't speak.
If you can't speak, don't write.
If you can't write, don't make your ego do it anyway.
I prefer your non-educational work.
Submitted by EmissionImpossible (user info) at 2010-02-22 07:13:35 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
i need no advice!
Submitted by F.J.Bell (user info) at 2010-02-22 07:10:12 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
Iddy, these aren't bullshit rules, they're good solid advice for writers of all standards. I bet if you try some of them out you will find your own work improves :o)
Submitted by iddqd (user info) at 2010-02-22 07:06:40 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
Submitted by orphelia (user info) at 2010-02-22 06:11:51 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
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Submitted by iddqd (user info) at 2010-02-22 06:10:57 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
rules of writing are for teachers of writing courses who almost invariably are failures.
do what feels right, then get an editor to clean it up.
good rules are for editors.
~~~
lol
say's he
---
yeah, i do orphelia, because as pretentious as i behave here, never ONCE have i been so pretentious or clueless as to presume to post some bullshit rules about writing.
but you wouldnt have a fucking clue anyway, youre a fat ugly old bint, and im not even sure why i bothered responding. maybe i have an illness.
Submitted by ridiculous (user info) at 2010-02-22 06:15:17 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
I like this, I can really identify with some of the things herein and hope to try some of the recommended techniques.
Submitted by F.J.Bell (user info) at 2010-02-22 06:14:13 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
Pheeley!
I was going to attach a nudey pic to this but I couldn't find a picture of boobs and books together.
Submitted by F.J.Bell (user info) at 2010-02-22 06:13:07 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
Indeed, that is probably the most important one.
Submitted by orphelia (user info) at 2010-02-22 06:13:00 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
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Submitted by F.J.Bell (user info) at 2010-02-22 06:09:45 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
These are just some guidelines that I found helpful and wanted to share :o)
~~~
If you are that bored and in the mood for sharing we could have just spent the morning swapping nudey pics of each other and being rude. God, you only have to say. :)
Submitted by HurtByTheSun (user info) at 2010-02-22 06:12:27 EST (#)
Ranking: -2
Suddenly, I LOLed:
Work on a computer that is disconnected from the internet.
Submitted by orphelia (user info) at 2010-02-22 06:11:51 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
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Submitted by iddqd (user info) at 2010-02-22 06:10:57 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
rules of writing are for teachers of writing courses who almost invariably are failures.
do what feels right, then get an editor to clean it up.
good rules are for editors.
~~~
lol
say's he
Submitted by iddqd (user info) at 2010-02-22 06:10:57 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
rules of writing are for teachers of writing courses who almost invariably are failures.
do what feels right, then get an editor to clean it up.
good rules are for editors.
Submitted by F.J.Bell (user info) at 2010-02-22 06:10:49 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
Of course, rules are there to be broken, but it helps to be aware of which rules we are disregarding and why.
Submitted by F.J.Bell (user info) at 2010-02-22 06:09:45 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
These are just some guidelines that I found helpful and wanted to share :o)
Submitted by orphelia (user info) at 2010-02-22 06:09:30 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
ps stop posting your homework.
Submitted by orphelia (user info) at 2010-02-22 06:07:35 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
Never use a verb other than "said" to carry dialogue. The line of dialogue belongs to the character; the verb is the writer sticking his nose in. But "said" is far less intrusive than "grumbled", "gasped", "cautioned", "lied".
~~~
Once the pattern of conversation is established, and the reader is certain who is saying what, you can do away with 'said' too.
Said Pheeley.
Submitted by orphelia (user info) at 2010-02-22 06:05:27 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
What the Hell is this, FJ?
Submitted by pen_name (user info) at 2010-02-22 05:47:42 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
Lost me at "a selection of rules"
Only rule about writing is that you should read more than you write. Can't be a writer if you don't like to read.
l8ers :P
Submitted by EmissionImpossible (user info) at 2010-02-22 05:40:35 EST (#)
Ranking: 1
good for you